[spam score 2/10 -pobox] [TriLUG] Linux Support Position (OT)
Andrew C. Oliver
acoliver at apache.org
Sat Jul 6 13:40:25 EDT 2002
On Sat, 2002-07-06 at 12:46, John Turner wrote:
> I have worked many years as a SA and I happen to have a M.S. in C.S. I
> can't say that I ever took a course that taught SA directly, but I know
> that some schools have such today. Some of the best SAs I know have
> advanced degrees. I think that schools give students (or at least they
> did) the chance to learn skills by doing. One thing most companies don't
> seem to follow, for good reason.
>
I've yet to see that.
> What I find more of a concern than companies wanting SAs with more
> skills, are the companies that are willing to get by with a SA who has
> no real background and just played with his/her machine at home. There
> is a big difference between running a home Linux machine and managing 10
> production servers or 50 development workstations.
>
That would be a symptom of the "lowest bidder" or the former "nepotism"
(which has gone out the door) trend.
> As for degrees and SAs, I would say there are always exceptions, but for
> the most part having a degree that requires some analytical skills would
> show a company that you can solve problems that are new to you. And that
> is the sign of a great SA. Most people can follow that install/setup/xxx
> instructions that are provided with systems/software today. But what
> happens when things don't go right? How do you start to figure out what
> is causing the problem?
>
I don't have a degree, I tend to solve problems rather quickly, but I'm
not an SA (assuming you mean Sysadmin). I think the worst SAs I've come
across were the ones that came right out of college with no actual field
experience. I've always found them frustrating because I have to do
their job for them without bruising their ego and the access to fix it
myself. "Why no I don't think the 10 processor machine is processor
bound, why don't we consider that maybe this could be a io issue...maybe
having one big fat disk in the machine might not be such a great idea
eh?"
> As a SA you have to be involved in many areas. You have to understand
> the applications that are running, what requirements they have, how to
> monitor their performance. I wouldn't expect for a SA to develop the DB
> schema, but I would require him/her to be able to manage the DB
> installation (including install, manage, and to some level tune). If
> you are running a departments mail/file/print server than I would expect
> most experienced users could manage to look good in that role. However,
> if you are ask to manage a production cluster of servers running a
> distributed application, I would expect some background in operating
> systems, computer networking, etc. would be helpful, and that is the
> kind of stuff I learn at school.
>
Gee do you work for $30/hr, have 10 years experience, a doctorate in
theoretical physics? Maybe you apply to be an SA at one of the firms
currently posting job opps. :-)
-Andy
> John
>
>
> On Saturday, July 6, 2002, at 09:44 AM, Mike Mueller wrote:
>
> > I was wondering about the
> > requirements I've seen in employment ads. The combinations of skills
> > and
> > proficiencies required are rather escalated. The current environment is
> > particularly useful for developing a database of people with technical
> > skills. The cost per resume collected must be very attractive right
> > now.
> >
> > The ideal skill set seems to be 5-10 years in a non-telecom business,
> > SA for
> > *nix and MS, Cisco certified, and expert ability to program in Perl,
> > C++, VB,
> > and Java. Candidates with brain surgery and rocket science experience
> > are
> > preferred.
> >
> > Now is a good time to hone those marketing (over-promising) skills.
> > Ugh. It
> > conjures up thoughts of infomercials where the announcer extolls the
> > viewer
> > to call now to get a FREE set of Linux SA's with the purchase.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> > On Friday 05 July 2002 22:44, Andrew C. Oliver reputedly wrote:
> >> Yes.... I've experienced Sysadmin-type slash DBAs first hand. Its
> >> not a
> >> nice trend. Its may be actually
> >> worse than the previous Programmer slash DBAs....
> >>
> >> -Andy
> >>
> >> Thunder Bear wrote:
> >>> On Fri, 2002-06-28 at 19:20, Jon Carnes wrote:
> >>>> BTW: the days of a System Admin doing only Systems work is fading
> >>>> rapidly
> >>>> (if not already gone). SA's need extended skills in one or more of
> >>>> the
> >>>> follow: Programming, Database/Web Applications design, or even a
> >>>> degree
> >>>> in Business. In this respect, the traditional Universities are a
> >>>> great
> >>>> help.
> >>>
> >>> Oh yes it's crazy. Look at most of the sysadmin job listings today.
> >>> You need to be both a sysadmin and what would traditionally be
> >>> called a
> >>> DBA. The DBA jobs are being absorbed into sysadmin jobs. And Jon is
> >>> right, those other skills at least need to be part of your utility
> >>> belt.
> >>>
> >>> IMHO many businesses are starting to put impossible expectations on
> >>> what
> >>> they will get out of their sysadmins. There aren't many of us, for
> >>> example, that can show proficiency in both Windows and UNIX networks,
> >>> but yet that isn't enough anymore. And they will pay for these
> >>> unreasonable expectations in the end when they get one guy who can do
> >>> everything a little bit but nothing particularly well.
> >>
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> >
> > --
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